JONDE, 35 años. Entrevista con José Luis Turina / JONDE, 35 Years. Interview with José: Luis Turina

By Mario Muñoz Carrasco

Interview conducted prior to the reportage published in issue no. 349 of Scherzo magazine (Madrid, March 2019)


Question: What do you think JONDE has meant for musicians, on the one hand, and for the world of professional orchestras on the other? What is JONDE's philosophy? How did you find the situation and the level of young musicians upon your arrival?
Answer: Unlike what would have been logical given its essentially educational nature, JONDE was created in 1983 at the initiative of the Ministry of Culture rather than that of Education. We must look back to those years to fully understand the sense of its creation and what it meant for the situation of music education at that time. During those years, professional music education was in total chaos (overcrowded schools, all levels mixed in a single conservatory, lack of an alternative model of non-formal music education, etc.), with the direct consequence being an inability to have a sufficient number of qualified professionals to sustain an increasingly intense musical life (we should recall that the 1980s saw the widespread creation of symphony orchestras and auditoriums across the country). Since the Ministry of Education had yet to take action, it fell to the Ministry of Culture to take the lead with some initiatives, among which the creation of JONDE stands out as a beacon.
For young musicians, it became a point of reference for directing their medium- and long-term training; for professional orchestras, with a more immediate need, the shortage of skilled instrumentalists led them to seek musicians from beyond our borders. Thirty-five years later, in a fortunately very different situation, we now find musicians who were once JONDE members in all the orchestras, and the abundance of regional and local youth orchestras offers significant early experience in orchestral repertoire.
Reaching this point required a long journey, consolidated in the 1990s with a profound reform of music education, lifting our country from the bottom ranks it occupied for decades to the forefront of the European Union, both quantitatively and qualitatively. This progress is demonstrated by the excellent results that young Spanish musicians have achieved in annual auditions for the two main European youth orchestras, the European Union Youth Orchestra (EUYO) and the Gustav Mahler Youth Orchestra. Just days ago, we saw the results for the 2019 Spanish candidates for EUYO: 32 accepted and 50 reserves! This means that more than a quarter of the orchestra will be composed of Spanish musicians, something unthinkable not so long ago.
There are many aspects of this reform worth highlighting (the separation of levels, the creation of music schools, clarifying professional education, structuring curricula, etc.), but if I had to highlight one, it would be the mandatory inclusion of orchestral training for all symphonic specialties starting from the intermediate level. This has not only been a great educational enhancement in orchestral practice, but it has also rationalized the staff and specializations offered, enabling schools to guarantee the development of this type of training. In a word: gone are the days of "piano and trumpet conservatories" -and similar setups- so common in previous decades. The creation of JONDE, in a way, was the starting signal for all of this.

Q.: Why do you think the youth orchestra model arrived in Spain so late?
A.: It certainly could have arrived much earlier, but it didn't because the necessary conditions to make it feasible simply were not there. Specifically, in the case of JONDE: the drive of a director, Edmon Colomer, who passionately defended a project he firmly believed in, and the unwavering support of a public official, José: Manuel Garrido Guzmá:n, then Director-General of Music and Theatre (soon to be INAEM), who convinced the rest of the administrative forces -the Ministry of Culture, and no less importantly, the Treasury- to give it legal status and a budget, making it a reality. Later, in JONDE's shadow, all the other youth orchestras began to emerge.

Q.: What are the benefits of having various renowned conductors lead the orchestra compared to the more traditional model of a fixed principal conductor?
A.: JONDE is not a professional orchestra with a stable season; it is a training project. In the case of a professional orchestra, a principal conductor is essential to give coherence to a season's programming and to develop a unique identity for the orchestra. However, in a youth orchestra, it is more important to offer the broadest possible experience to its members, and due to the continuous turnover of musicians (who typically stay for only two or three years), there is no sense in aiming for a consolidated sectional work with a long-term vision. If, during their time in JONDE, the musicians have had the chance to work with six, seven, or eight distinguished conductors, they will have encountered six, seven, or eight different -and equally valid- ways of understanding the conductor/orchestra relationship, which is generally quite complex. Having a single conductor throughout this period wouldn't add much beyond the orchestral practice experience they already bring from their respective conservatories.

Q.: Could you explain the structure of JONDE's working periods? Is it an intermediate step between the training world and the real pace of professional orchestras?
A.: A youth orchestra can sound just as good or even better than a professional one, but professional musicians have developed over the years certain reflexes and speed to rehearse a repertoire in very few days, which young musicians logically lack. To achieve the same results, more work time is required, and this is achieved through periodic working periods where all activities are maximized. JONDE's working periods follow the structure of any youth orchestra's: (1) During the first three or four days, a team of teachers from various specialties -drawn from both Spanish orchestras and Europe's leading orchestras- prepare the repertoire separately, each with their section, with a first collective reading of the programmed pieces under the assistant conductor's lead; (2) once this phase is complete, the guest conductor takes charge of assembling and refining the work done by the teachers in the previous partial and sectional rehearsals over another three or four days; and (3) a final concert tour (averaging three to five performances) concludes the working period. The tours are primarily national, though at least once a year an international tour takes place, with JONDE regularly participating in the most important Spanish and European festivals.

Q.: Do you have data on the placement of musicians who have been through JONDE in other orchestras?
A.: It is practically impossible to track the professional career paths of musicians after they finish their time with the orchestra. Although we remain in communication with them -and continue to collaborate with those who are still under 30, through exchanges and projects with other European national youth orchestras, as well as with the Latin American systems of children's and youth orchestras, to which young musicians primarily lend educational support- the norm is that once they move into their professional lives (which, given job insecurity, is necessarily very changeable), they are absorbed by their work and feel no obligation to report back to us, just as we are not obligated to ask. We often receive news of former JONDE members achieving outstanding results in auditions for major orchestras in the European Union, but these tend to be specific cases; for most, we don't hear back, so we can't engage in such follow-up.
In contrast, we make the most of the information we have about them while they are part of JONDE. Every year we publish several statistics (age, gender, region of origin), among which the most notable are those related to the results of the annual admission tests, with exact data on participation and the results obtained by candidates based on the Conservatory in which they study. These statistics are very telling of the current health of higher education in our country and should also serve as a point of reflection for educational administrations where such education does not yield the results one would expect given the high investment made.

Q.: What is your opinion on the percentage of young musicians in Spanish orchestras? Do you think it is balancing out?
A.: As I mentioned in the answer to the first question, the massive import of foreign professionals was a widespread practice in the numerous symphony orchestras created in the 1980s and 90s. This means that these professionals -not only making a first-class symphonic life feasible, which most of our regions could not have imagined a few years earlier, but also educating many generations of young people in their areas, outside of formal education- are now reaching retirement age. As a result, many positions will open up in the coming years, which will undoubtedly be filled by new musicians who are now excellently prepared to occupy them. Spain currently has the best-trained generation of performers in its history: it is now time for them to have their moment to prove it.

Q.: The energy radiating from JONDE is very palpable. Do you believe JONDE plays an important role in policies aimed at reaching new audiences and rejuvenating them? Have you noticed a change in the audience over these nearly two decades at the orchestra's helm?
A.: As I mentioned earlier, JONDE is committed to providing high-quality training to its members, which includes in-depth work on the traditional symphonic repertoire as well as 20th-century masterpieces and the most contemporary creations. Few things bring more joy to a composer than being programmed by an orchestra like this one, where works are not simply read through and then rehearsed at a general rehearsal, as is usually the case, but are instead worked on in detail -both in sections and as a whole- for many days, with the composer present whenever possible. This experience is also crucial for the musicians, as their attitude toward contemporary creation -often met with some resistance when they first arrive- radically changes when they engage with it in this way.

Q.: Tell us about the Contemporary Music Academy.
A.: It was an initiative that emerged in the early years of my tenure, coinciding with Jorge Ferná:ndez Guerra's directorship at the Center for the Promotion of Contemporary Music (CDMC). In fact, the Academy began as a CDMC activity for which JONDE provided instrumentalists. Over time, it became clear that it made more sense for the orchestra to manage the project, collaborating frequently with the CDMC, especially at the Alicante Contemporary Music Festival, where we were able to undertake very interesting projects. Later on, we saw that contemporary music was appearing frequently enough in JONDE's regular programming -both symphonic and chamber music- that its practice, now fully integrated, no longer required specific attention, and it became part of the orchestra's normal activities. A recent statistical study on the programming over the past 10 years provides some telling data: in 2018, for example, out of the 55 programmed works -symphonic and chamber, with special emphasis on the latter- only 13 were by composers prior to the 20th century. Of the remaining 42, 15 were by composers who passed away in the first half of the century, and 4 in the second half. The other 23 were by living or recently deceased composers. Equally important: of the 55 works performed, 22 were by Spanish composers.

Q.: What do you think the future holds for JONDE? Where do you see it in 35 years?
A.: It is impossible for me to answer a question projecting so far into the future, especially when making predictions even for the coming years is difficult. We cannot forget that JONDE exists and has become what it is because it was born and developed within a public administration that provided everything necessary for its existence. Every general director I've encountered over these years -and there have been quite a few in these eighteen years - has supported it unreservedly. Despite the economic challenges of the past decade, JONDE has continued its work, albeit with activity scaled back in line with the annual budget. Instead of speculating, it's better to be realistic: in that sense, let's hope that, regardless of political and economic circumstances, the project continues to receive the same level of support -a project that has far exceeded the expectations set for it when it was created.


Link to JONDE, 35 years of a necessary utopia
By Mario Muñoz Carrasco
Reportage published in issue no. 349 of Scherzo magazine (Madrid, March 2019)